Am I going right wing????

[dvtimes]

Just watching the poloyics show, and they are saying they are changing the 1945 overcrouding law.

One family had 5 kids living in a 2 bedroom flat.

She was moaning as she wanted a bigger house.

As I watch this, I just sit thinking, but your the one who had the kids!!!!!

Surly you should take responsibility for yyour situation.

I guess I get angry as I see old people who went to war, payed tax all there life, live on nothing. While you get people who think lets have loads of kids as the state should look after us.

I have no problems with people who find it hard to get a job and need the dole. But what bugs me is these people that just have 5 or more kids, none bother to work, as they know the state pays them well. And they get prority over other families.

[JT]

I have no problems with people who find it hard to get a job and need the dole.

In the current economic climate, there shouldnt be hardly anyone on the dole.

[Smooch]

It's the onset of middle age. In tens years time you'll be a full blown Tory.

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/2185/11paperql4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[dvtimes]

In the current economic climate, there shouldnt be hardly anyone on the dole.

Not sure.

If your on a low wage, your better off being on the dole than getting a poor paied job. Plus these days with cost of travel increasing.

[wankmaster]

I never understood why people on the dole could not be found something useful to do in the community. It would be better than them sat watching channel 4 racing all day long, and would give them some self respect and purpose. Also the habbit getting up in a morning and having something to do would give them a better chance of getting a job and ward off depression.

It's really against human dignity to live on handouts, unless you are very severly disabled there should be a small job available for you. Obligation goes with entitlement, it's a very simple equation.

[fredicus]

Just watching the poloyics show, and they are saying they are changing the 1945 overcrouding law.

One family had 5 kids living in a 2 bedroom flat.

She was moaning as she wanted a bigger house.

As I watch this, I just sit thinking, but your the one who had the kids!!!!!

Surly you should take responsibility for yyour situation.

I agree, if their not smart enough to figure out how to use a condom, are they smart enough to raise kids?

.

[dvtimes]

I agree, if their not smart enough to figure out how to use a condom, are they smart enough to raise kids?

.

To me its that expectation that the state will provide all.

Years ago when i was at school, i had a mate (yes i did have them) who had a house near by. It was mum dad and brother and sister.

But it was the attitude from them that they had a right to have kids and the state pay. His dad was a wast of space, just lived in a fantasy world. He was fit and heathy, but no interest in work. And to be honest he looked a mess.

But it just carries on. He is no different now. Got kids of his own. Lets the state take care of him. It simply runs from one generation to the next.

The thing is, you can these days just get a bucket of hot water and stand by the road charging £5 to clean cars. You can pull in easily £40 an hour.

[-HF]

I never understood why people on the dole could not be found something useful to do in the community. It would be better than them sat watching channel 4 racing all day long, and would give them some self respect and purpose. Also the habbit getting up in a morning and having something to do would give them a better chance of getting a job and ward off depression.

It's really against human dignity to live on handouts, unless you are very severly disabled there should be a small job available for you. Obligation goes with entitlement, it's a very simple equation.
th problem is, hardly anything they could do isn't already done by someone who gets paid for it, so you may end up replacing someone who has a job by someone who gets unemployment support, thus causing 2 needing the support.

Germany introduced the so called 1-Euro-jobs. it was meant to help long term unemployed to get some job for usually 6 to 9 months, on top of their unemployment benefit they are paid 1 Euro - currenty 67p - an hour, to pay for the extra expsenses they have from that, like getting to and from work. the original idea proposed was they should work in fields that couldn't be covered with fully paid staff.
it has however had a major impact on the childcare and health sectors for example, replacing trained staff with cheap work force. councils use the 1-Euro-workers where they used proper craftsmen or companies before, hence putting those jobs at risk.

the result is a mass of cheap work force that endangers those in a job and might be a vicious circle for those trapped in it.
'what are your experiences?'
'1 worked as 1-Euro-slave for the last 2 years.'
'ah yes. we will call you....'

while one could argue those that are willing to do the 1-Euro jobs are very willing to work at all, it should be taken into account that not accepting a job offer will see them lose part of their benefits and the that 1-Euro jobs are not exactly qualified jobs. you'll hardly want to see them on your CV.

[wankmaster]

the result is a mass of cheap work force that endangers those in a job and might be a vicious circle for those trapped in it.
'what are your experiences?'
'1 worked as 1-Euro-slave for the last 2 years.'
'ah yes. we will call you....'



As opposed to
'what are your experiences?'
'I sat on my arse and watched racing on Channel 4'.
'Just the man we need...'

[-HF]

As opposed to
'what are your experiences?'
'I sat on my arse and watched racing on Channel 4'.
'Just the man we need...'

i see you focus right on the important bit.

[Inbedwithfaith]

I think the problem is that nowadays people dont have skills. I think if britain returned to the old system of technical colleges and grammar schools we would be better off. There is a short supply of skilled workers, if people had more skills they wouldnt have to take low paid jobs so they wouldnt have to claim benefits. I mean getting a plumber or a decent builder is a nightmare if more people were trained in useful jobs instead of going to university and getting a useless degree we'd be better off.

[wankmaster]

i see you focus right on the important bit.


Well, unfortunatly the logic of the rest of it was sound, so I couldn't really argue the toss.

[Damian]

I think the problem is that nowadays people dont have skills. I think if britain returned to the old system of technical colleges and grammar schools we would be better off. There is a short supply of skilled workers, if people had more skills they wouldnt have to take low paid jobs so they wouldnt have to claim benefits. I mean getting a plumber or a decent builder is a nightmare if more people were trained in useful jobs instead of going to university and getting a useless degree we'd be better off.

Yeah, the Youth Training Scheme was brilliant. Come back Thatcher! We need you.

Damn those stupid idiots wasting 3 years of their lives at university. What audacity. Did they not realise they could get PAID actual MONEY learning to mop up water around a plumber?

[Inbedwithfaith]

Yeah, the Youth Training Scheme was brilliant. Come back Thatcher! We need you.

Damn those stupid idiots wasting 3 years of their lives at university. What audacity. Did they not realise they could get PAID actual MONEY learning to mop up water around a plumber?

Not everyone is an academic and not everyone should go to university. How many graduates come out of uni and actually get a job straight away? Im sure theres some that do but a lot of them are unemployed because there are too many going to university doing the same degrees then going for the same job. Wheres if they got a skill they could set up on their own. Plumbing may not be as glamourous as marketing but its a job that will always exist. People will always require plumbers, builders and joiners.

[wankmaster]

I wasted four years at University. I never used anything I learned in my degree save for a bit of maths that I could have learned anyway on my own.

Cause of graduate unemployment? We don't need so many graduates. It's not rocket science.

[Inbedwithfaith]

I wasted four years at University. I never used anything I learned in my degree save for a bit of maths that I could have learned anyway on my own.

Cause of graduate unemployment? We don't need so many graduates. It's not rocket science.

Thank you! My point exactly.

[wankmaster]

I wanted to program computers, but there were no undergraduate degrees in the subject at the time so I did something else technical, but it was really of no help. In restrospect I should have gone to a polytechnic, but I didn't really know what they were.

Bad careers advice I guess.

[Inbedwithfaith]

If you are going to go to university, then study something that will be profitable when you graduate. Then you won't be unemployed. Its easy to waste four years studying philosophy. Not a bad gig, but you need to spend a few more years so you can actually teach it. Because there is not a lot of work for philosophers in the job centres. Extreme example to make a point.

A lot of the people i know did either sociology, philsophy or english. Only useful if u wanna be a teacher and we havent got enough of those either!

[wankmaster]

When I was in the 6th form six kids did physics 'A' level. About sixty did geography 'A' level. They had to run extra classes. When I asked those kids why they did geography, they said cos it was an easy subject. When I asked them what job they hoped for, most of them wanted to be geography teachers.

There's a logic there somewhere.

[heidi84]

People with one or two children claming benefits does happen, sometimes its to top up earnings in a poorly paid job or due to unforseen circumstances which i belive these people do deserve help.

If you sit on your arse all day and do nothing (and have done for several years) and have 5 kids then its your own fault!! Should you get a council house and benefits? Should you balls!!

When thinking about having a child the main thing you should think about is can i afford this child? If these people claim their kids were accidents they are liars as before it gets to 5 accidents the penny should drop you are doing somthing wrong. It really gives people who need this money a bad name, people who have one child and really want to go out to work and cannot afford to for example, they are seen as wrong because of these no brainers!!

[Guest]

If you are going to go to university, then study something that will be profitable when you graduate. Then you won't be unemployed. Its easy to waste four years studying philosophy. Not a bad gig, but you need to spend a few more years so you can actually teach it. Because there is not a lot of work for philosophers in the job centres. Extreme example to make a point.

Philosophy provides a foundation for various careers, such as journalism, advertising and marketing, jobs in the finance industry and so on. Few people get jos because of their knowledge of Kant, they do get them for their critical thinking skills.

[wankmaster]

You need post graduate qualifications for serious employment nowadays. It used to be that having a BA got you a great job. Those days are gone.

Pretty much so. An MA is the new BA, a PhD is the new MA, and 'A' levels are the new 'O' levels. I wish I could believe that people have suddenly gotten smarted or better educated, but my experience tells me different.

[Inbedwithfaith]

That is my point. You need post graduate qualifications for serious employment nowadays. It used to be that having a BA got you a great job. Those days are gone. High school grads are qualified for flipping burgers at Mickey Dees or, dare I say, Porn. And even in porn, if you have a background in film making, photography, marketing or business, you will do better than most. Qualifications and skills are so important in life. I meet way too many people in this business that just want to get rich and think posing for or taking dirty pictures will do it for them.


I suppose that last comment was aimed at me? I was half way to becoming an accountant when i started this. My point simply is that a degree isnt everything. All a degree proves to an employer is that you can do what your told adn you'll stay in line.

[Damian]

Not everyone is an academic and not everyone should go to university. How many graduates come out of uni and actually get a job straight away? Im sure theres some that do but a lot of them are unemployed because there are too many going to university doing the same degrees then going for the same job. Wheres if they got a skill they could set up on their own. Plumbing may not be as glamourous as marketing but its a job that will always exist. People will always require plumbers, builders and joiners.

Well don't do an academic course then?

The point of university is not to study philosphy for 4 years and come and be a philosophist. It's just to demonstrate to employers a certain level of education.

Of course, you could do a practical degree such as teaching, or sport studies. Mine certainly wasn't in marketing or business and yet lo! here I am working in marketing.

I think there is obviously scope for some kind of apprentice programme, but sadly since about 1970 they have all been shit rip offs exploiting kids.

Everyone that possibly can should go to uni, it just opens more doors for you.

[strictlybroadband]

I suppose that last comment was aimed at me? I was half way to becoming an accountant when i started this. My point simply is that a degree isnt everything. All a degree proves to an employer is that you can do what your told adn you'll stay in line.

There are other reasons for education than just for your career. People should be equipped with the ability to argue rationally, and with an understanding of basic science, history and world affairs, even if they don't need these skills for work. For example if people had better understanding of nutritional science, they would eat better and the health of the country would improve.

After all, he we all are discussing interesting issues that have nothing to do with the porn industry. We clearly aren't limited by what we do for a living.

Most other European countries put value on knowledge for its own sake. It's a particularly Anglo-Saxon way of thinking to say that people shouldn't be educated in something unless they can use it to make money.

[Inbedwithfaith]

That last comment was not aimed at you. I don't even know you or what your education is. It was a general comment having had a few years in this business. A degree is much more than proof of servitude. A useful degree with post grad qualifications is hugely valueable. Do you want to see an underqualified doctor. Would you hire a solicitor that wasn't well versed in law? I don't have a degree, just a lowly certificate in broadcast journalism, but it did me very well. However, times change.

I didnt mean everyone should shun university. Of course we need trained doctors, solicitors etc. I just think a lot of people are pushed into it, its now the in thing to go be a student for 3/4 years. I had a friend who went to university and picked sociology simply because it had the least ammount of required lectures. She did the degree and now cant get a job simply because a lot of people had the same idea. Shes now working as a waitress and shes got about 10K worth of debt which she knows she has to repay. I believe if you want to succeed dont bother with university, start your own thing and be your own boss. If you want to make someone else money go to university.

[Damian]

I believe if you want to succeed dont bother with university, start your own thing and be your own boss.

Guess that depends on one's definiation of success really.

[WordsforHire]

In my eyes degrees and uni are overrated.

You spend 3/4 years getting yourself in debt for a qualification that may ever come in handy.

Granted for some positions it's very useful and often needed.

But you'll find a LOT of students go to uni as it's the easy way out. 'I'll get a student load, party for 4 years and everything withh be super fun, I just have to make sure I go to class'.

Uni/college/school is not the real world.

I left school at 16. I have my GCSE's and that's it. Mind you, there are top grades but still that's all I have. I believe I would have gotten great a levels should I have stayed on but when I look at the other girls and boys from school that did I thank god that I never did.

They are so, what's the word, I'm looking for? Not used to real life thins like bills, responsibilities etc. They don't know the first thing about running a house, preparing for saving, getting a mortgage, not gettin themselves into debt etc. These things aren't taught at school. And A levels don't teach you these things either.

I run a business, run a home, raise a child and I'm still a kid by age. If I had stayed on at school I'd have ended up like my mates from school - thinking it's super exciting now that I can get into pubs and clubs legally and that driving some minted little saxo is the coolest thing since burberry and baseball caps.

[Inbedwithfaith]

I totally agree Jade!

[WordsforHire]

Glad we can agree on something ;) lol :)

[WordsforHire]

That is all worst case stuff. Just about everyone I know with useful degrees would disagree with this. Post secondary education, whether it be university, technical college, or trade school is essential (there are, of course, exceptions). Porn can be a skill...actually, its just business...that can be learned by ojt. However, if you have skills that you bring to the table you will prolly do much better even in this game.

BTW, what is wrong with ball caps? I have worn them all my life. They aren't some fly by night goofy style. They are like blue jeans.
Ball caps are fine, if you don't weear the trackies, the socks over the bottom of the trackies and the burbery chav style items that go with it :)

It's not worse case stuff over here - it's the norm.

Of course there ARE people with useful degrees and that do use them, however lots of people just go to uni as it's easy life as a student...

Porn is just like any other business, without skills and hard work it's going to fail but you don't need a degree or special qualification to know how to get your tits out.

Lots of people go and do these four year courses are ways for people to kill some time and enjoy themselves for a bit longer while they work out where they want to go in life and most of the times they never actually get around to using these things in the first place!

[WordsforHire]

We all have our own wants - I'd personally never go back to a classroom. I can't learn anything there that I can't learn myself at home with books.

[wankmaster]

We all have our own wants - I'd personally never go back to a classroom. I can't learn anything there that I can't learn myself at home with books.

I only attended a few lectures in my time at university, I soon found out they were a waste. I just went to the library and read up on my own.

I got a better education by that method.

[smoothballs]

comes down to pride....since leaving school in '82 only ever had one dole cheque, and as of last year claiming benefits for the first time in my life bacause of ankle injury....never again! they wanted £175 back, council tax kept going down but direct debit never got taken out and i owed them too....

bottom line is , if im ever off work again for a injury im not claiming fuck all! too much hassle and its still on going now...still trying to play catch up

[pleasureville]

comes down to pride....since leaving school in '82 only ever had one dole cheque, and as of last year claiming benefits for the first time in my life bacause of ankle injury....never again! they wanted £175 back, council tax kept going down but direct debit never got taken out and i owed them too....

bottom line is , if im ever off work again for a injury im not claiming fuck all! too much hassle and its still on going now...still trying to play catch up

How did you brake your ankle.. it would be annoying if it was for work!
Similar here though.. you have to work hard and not just take cash from the goverment...
we moan that our country has no money and then try and claim everything...
Not meaning you shouldnt.. if you were not able to work.. fair play!

[WordsforHire]

Some people dont have a choice though I'm afraid.

Paul got sacked when the baby was 6 weeks old. I wasn't getting maternnity pay as I had to quit work because of very severe pregnancy problems so at the time we had no money and we had to go on Income support while Paul found a new job.

He quickly found some contract work which paid the bills and no more and in that tie Paul and I quickly started or online business as an extra way to make ends meet, then we found out it was so popular he jacked in worked and it beacame our full time jobs lol.

Some people with young kids etc, dont have the option of just going out and getting any job they like. If I was a single mother and I lost a current job I had I'd have to find a job that worked around my kid if I couldn't find that I'd be fucked.

Some people have no choice, what pisses me of is when people like some I know o on it and think well, lets have nother kid so I dont have to go out to work and stay on it for as long as it suits em.

[wankmaster]

It's always a balancing act. If you make it to comfy to be on welfare nobody wants to work, on the other hand you need to provide for those in genuine need. The problem here is big government. Dole is given out according to rules by civil servants. The was a program on the box years ago about welfare in Switzerland, they do it at a village level, so the community pays and decides how best to help. I saw them fix up a single mother with some childcare and work as well as immediate help.

Another model is to allow church (or mosque) groups to handle welfare issues.

We've gone to far down the socialist road tho maybe for that to work here.

[smoothballs]

How did you brake your ankle.. it would be annoying if it was for work!
Similar here though.. you have to work hard and not just take cash from the goverment...
we moan that our country has no money and then try and claim everything...
Not meaning you shouldnt.. if you were not able to work.. fair play!

I got run over by a car, ended up with a dislocated foot and fractured ankle both sides...all done and dusted now....just the damn plate and screws! lol

[-HF]

Well, unfortunatly the logic of the rest of it was sound, so I couldn't really argue the toss.

even if you hadn't agreed with the logic, reality would still remain. ;)