the lies about file sharing

[-HF]

the other day i had a thought which i considered to be revolting, hence my urge to share it :D

a common excuse i hear when i argue with people about file sharing and why it's wrong is "today's music industry is so streamlined, you only hear crap anymore, so why buy that shit"

while i do to a certain extent agree with this sentiment when it comes to the quality, i also wonder, if that music is so crap, why would you listen to it when it's free? and if what the music industry releases is so crappy, why aren't the P2P download "charts", read the list of stolen music, majorly different from the normal top 10? why aren't other songs leading? and why aren't these other songs bought?

[JT]

When I was younger, I use to tape my songs from the radio, I was happy with the quality because I didnt know any better. So I do wonder if the record companies are loosing any more now than they did then. People will always like to get their hands on a real copy if they really like a band.

But I think record companies need to change their business model, cheap downloading of music is they way forward. Otherwise the net will do to them what we have done to porn mags.

[-HF]

what is cheap for doanloads though? the current model with some 99 cents (IIRC) makes it 10 bucks for a full CD, for a little more i get the CD in the shop, with a printed disk and booklet. at this rate downloading cannot really win.

i'm just confused about the P2P user argument about the crappy music. surely it doesn't get any less crappy if you steal it.

[fredicus]

F*ck the music industry, they deserve no sympathy from anyone.
I saw an ad for a re-issue of "War of the Worlds", I think they wanted £17.99 for it!!
What a ripoff! That album mad it's money, and then some, years ago, and now their trying to sell it again for more than it cost the first time around :mad:
F*ck the music industry !

Aah, I feel better now :)

[JT]

F*ck the music industry, they deserve no sympathy from anyone.
I saw an ad for a re-issue of "War of the Worlds", I think they wanted £17.99 for it!!
What a ripoff! That album mad it's money, and then some, years ago, and now their trying to sell it again for more than it cost the first time around :mad:
F*ck the music industry !

Aah, I feel better now :)

I think to some extent I agree with you, especially in the fact that we pay twice as much as anyone else in the world to buy something that costs pence to produce

[dvtimes]

I find it hard to understand why it costs about £11 for a cd that cost a few thousand to produce, yet a DVD will cost the same, but a film could cost several million to make.

I like to buy my films as I think it encourages them to make more good films.

The music industry got greedy. I did not mind buying records as it felt like you have something worth something. But cd's just feel cheap and disposable.

I do feel Sony messed up on the mini disc, as this should have replaced the cd. But those little music machines took over, such as ipods.

The crazy thing is, is that if you have one of these little gadgets, you are forced to pirate music to get them onto the machine. Its a bit like Rizzlers, we all know that 99% are used to smoke a certain substance.

Now the music industry is in a mess. It has overcharged people for years.

If I was them, I would sell the cd's for £3. I am sure that they would still make a huge profit. At £3 most people will buy the cd as at that price its not worth the hassle of downloading.

I used to buy lots of records, but now I do not bother. I am not going to spend £12 of just a few songs. Not when if I buy a DVD film for £12 not only I get a film, but often lots of extras, and even a pc game included.

for me a pirated DVD film sucks because to copy it, you must remove all the extra bits. I like them, and so happy to spend the cash.

There is no reason for people to buy a cd these days, not when they can get a blank cd for 2p, and make a copy.

Also I am not going to download a song for £1.

If you could download full albums for say £2, then I probably would.

But do I get upset by all those over rich pop stars, then the answer is no.

To be honest, if it was me I would just give the music away free, but make the money from doing pop concerts. I.e., use the free music as a promo.

Any decent pop star will easily fill a stadium, and by doing so, make good money.

I see even the Beach Boys are in the UK at a outdoor concert.

[dvtimes]

F*ck the music industry, they deserve no sympathy from anyone.
I saw an ad for a re-issue of "War of the Worlds", I think they wanted £17.99 for it!!
What a ripoff! That album mad it's money, and then some, years ago, and now their trying to sell it again for more than it cost the first time around :mad:
F*ck the music industry !

Aah, I feel better now :)


Its because the film is out at the moment.

[dvtimes]

what is cheap for doanloads though? the current model with some 99 cents (IIRC) makes it 10 bucks for a full CD, for a little more i get the CD in the shop, with a printed disk and booklet. at this rate downloading cannot really win.

i'm just confused about the P2P user argument about the crappy music. surely it doesn't get any less crappy if you steal it.
If you go to the shops, most of the music is made by Sony and just one or two firms.

With P2P it means that you or I can make music, and get heard by millions of people with ease.

It means that no longer do the few music firms control what you hear.

You could be a pop group in the milldle of Africa, and now have a chance of being heard.

Up to now the music industry only takes on people THEY want. Just think of all the groups that could have been.

[-HF]

If you go to the shops, most of the music is made by Sony and just one or two firms.

With P2P it means that you or I can make music, and get heard by millions of people with ease.

It means that no longer do the few music firms control what you hear.

You could be a pop group in the milldle of Africa, and now have a chance of being heard.

Up to now the music industry only takes on people THEY want. Just think of all the groups that could have been.


and yet again you miss the point, how do you do that? on purpose?

that is EXACTLY what i'm saying, if the sold music was that bad, WHY aren't the indepedent oh so great bands and artists toppping the P2P charts? eh?

[-HF]

I do feel Sony messed up on the mini disc, as this should have replaced the cd. But those little music machines took over, such as ipods.

The crazy thing is, is that if you have one of these little gadgets, you are forced to pirate music to get them onto the machine.

this too is utter bullshit.

online shops like itunes, if you wanna refer to the ipods, and your legal right to make private copies of CDs you bought are covering that.

there is no need, no excuse for stealing.

[dvtimes]

and yet again you miss the point, how do you do that? on purpose?

that is EXACTLY what i'm saying, if the sold music was that bad, WHY aren't the indepedent oh so great bands and artists toppping the P2P charts? eh?
Just because music is good, does not mean it will hit the charts.

The top chunes are the ones that are promoted the best.

An example is the little frog that's at no 1 at the moment.

I bet there are very few classical records in the p2p charts, but these are far better music.

But, I have heard lots of people say that they downloaded a song. Then found they liked it, and so went out to buy the cd.

Its a bit like webmasters who give out free sample clips. People have a look, if they like, they may buy/join.

As with anything (inc porn) its what is promoted the best that get the sales. This does not mean its good, just that its promoted well.

I remember a few years ago the comedy, fall and rise of Reginald Perring. He bought a shop that sold junk, as in a square hoola hoop. But because it got publicity, it got loads of customers.

[dvtimes]

this too is utter bullshit.

online shops like itunes, if you wanna refer to the ipods, and your legal right to make private copies of CDs you bought are covering that.

there is no need, no excuse for stealing.

The fact is, how many people can be bothered to convert there cds to the new file format, when you can download (free) from the net.

In fact go to most car boot sales, and you can buy cd's FULL of converted music. Which is often safer and easer than using p2p.

[-HF]

Just because music is good, does not mean it will hit the charts.

The top chunes are the ones that are promoted the best.

An example is the little frog that's at no 1 at the moment.

I bet there are very few classical records in the p2p charts, but these are far better music.

But, I have heard lots of people say that they downloaded a song. Then found they liked it, and so went out to buy the cd.

Its a bit like webmasters who give out free sample clips. People have a look, if they like, they may buy/join.

As with anything (inc porn) its what is promoted the best that get the sales. This does not mean its good, just that its promoted well.

I remember a few years ago the comedy, fall and rise of Reginald Perring. He bought a shop that sold junk, as in a square hoola hoop. But because it got publicity, it got loads of customers.


i have a hunch you mix up the sales charts and the P2P downloads.

BTW, the comparison to webmasters giving away free samples doesn't fly. stolen material is not a free sample.

[-HF]

The fact is, how many people can be bothered to convert there cds to the new file format, when you can download (free) from the net.

In fact go to most car boot sales, and you can buy cd's FULL of converted music. Which is often safer and easer than using p2p.


and people not being bothered makes stealing and receiving right? your methods of logic escape me, i have to admit.

JFYI, CDex works like a charm, pulls all song data from the web so you don't even have to rename the file. and does an average song in 10 seconds on my system. i have yet to see the connection or boot sale that will give me anything that fast.

[dvtimes]

i have a hunch you mix up the sales charts and the P2P downloads.

BTW, the comparison to webmasters giving away free samples doesn't fly. stolen material is not a free sample.

What I am saying is that some groups now give away a song or two to get heard.

[-HF]

What I am saying is that some groups now give away a song or two to get heard.


that's not what you said at all. whatever.

[dvtimes]

and people not being bothered makes stealing and receiving right? your methods of logic escape me, i have to admit.

JFYI, CDex works like a charm, pulls all song data from the web so you don't even have to rename the file. and does an average song in 10 seconds on my system. i have yet to see the connection or boot sale that will give me anything that fast.
I am not saying stealing is correct.

What I am saying, is that unless the price is reduced, people will not want to spend the cash and so copy music.

These days, I do not bother buying, I just listen to it on DAB radio or net radio stations.

If cds were sold a lot less, then I may start to buy them again.

[dvtimes]

that's not what you said at all. whatever.


Its what I meant to say. :)

[NumptyNuts]

how would you all feel if you entire content bank was taken and plugged into a P2P file sharing community?

The fact of the matter is the music industry didn't beleive this would happen so quickly and have little time to adapt. Sooner or later it will all be pay per view, payper click etc

I was playing around with an ipod the other day,it was wicked :-) I was able to buy an album for less then £8 and some ebooks for $12. £8 for an album is a very fair price, they were over a fiver 14 years ago.

[-HF]

have to mind the quality though, and you lack the proper disc with printing as well as the booklet. and what if the mp3 player or whatever media you use to store the files on fucks up?

personally i prefer getting a CD and do the mp3 for car/player myself.

[NumptyNuts]

have to mind the quality though, and you lack the proper disc with printing as well as the booklet. and what if the mp3 player or whatever media you use to store the files on fucks up?

personally i prefer getting a CD and do the mp3 for car/player myself.


The idea of digital is o rid us of things like packaging and additional clutter. The album I downloaded sits in the iPod and and Hard drive on my pc. My experiece of CD's sugests that these are are easy to damage :-(

Less packaging less waste less damage to our environment

[-HF]

i'm quite aware about the idea behind peddling things in a digital form. however once ipods get lost and stolen like mobile phones do, you will soon find yourself in a position where you bought a numberof albums and need to download them again. which will undoubtly lead to some debates with the seller as the file as such wasn't corrupted but delivered in perfect condition, only that you lost it in some way.

also HD failures and the likes aren't that uncommon.

[NumptyNuts]

i'm quite aware about the idea behind peddling things in a digital form. however once ipods get lost and stolen like mobile phones do, you will soon find yourself in a position where you bought a numberof albums and need to download them again. which will undoubtly lead to some debates with the seller as the file as such wasn't corrupted but delivered in perfect condition, only that you lost it in some way.

also HD failures and the likes aren't that uncommon.

But the generations coming through understand the importance of backing up their data. In time iPod will have a service where by by the serial number they can log all you songs, track it if its nicked and some tries to use it.

My dad is 50 and has no PC he's just got the iPOD with all the shite I put on for him, hes a music lover and always has a portible sterio / cd player etc. His feedback to owning one is simple - oustanding!

[-HF]

But the generations coming through understand the importance of backing up their data.


really now. my mainstream biz in peddling PCs tells me a different story. :D